108 thoughts on “Lakers Fans In Eastside Riot!”

1. Really late to this but I grew up in the projects in East LA and I can say that the flyers did exist and although I have no recollection of what they said I did see them being passed around by veteranos who were at that time part of a born again christian church. Although most people think veteranos are only older ranking gang members many former gang members who are older still carry that moniker of veterano (many times not by choice but do to how we label people) and still somewhat carry much of that lifestyle without the gang banging and all that. The mentally of “we’re not like them” does exist because although many not all veteranos both in and out of the gang life might still be going in and out of jail for other reasons. That “we’re not like them” is a prison mentality and it does exist in some even years after.

   Not so much anymore but back then in East LA gang members still respected family and there was lines not to be crossed and I do remember older gang members telling the youth not to join in on the riots but it was mostly due too not allowing other gang members from South Central or Boyle Heights to come into East LA to riot and loot. So yes such things as gang members and retired veteranos being against the riots did happen. The flyering did take place but also the community itself did the exact same thing and maybe the gang members picked up on the same thing and followed suit. I was in JR High went the riots took place so my mentality was elsewhere but I do remember the community policing itself and protecting itself. One image I won’t ever forget is people with guns in hand sitting in cars and roof tops facing West keeping watch.

2. RobThomas, I think you owe Caxcan an apology. Thanks for the insight Joel.

3. Rob: It is me. Gracias for the kind words! And, while the Angels fans LOVE to point out they’re so much more civilized than Doyers fans, there’s been two fan deaths at Angel Stadium this decade; how many happened at Dodgers Stadium?

4. Tavo,

   Welcome to the conversation…

   On opening day a vato got shanked for sporting SF gear and taunting doyers fans…not sure about the extent of his injuries.

   Overall the conversation really picks up where the post about broadway left off.

   It’s a strange mix of what we do and don’t admit about our community.

   As I mentioend in that entry, I see myself as a Bill Cosby democrat. The lack of willingness on some peoples part to accept that raza acting like fools makes Raza look bad is just as unacceptable as the media coming in to showcase the bad behavior.

   The media makes for an easy target when trying to distract ourselves from the fact that raza is acting like a bunch of animals caught up in the mob mentality…think lord of the flies on atlantic blvd…

   In the end, the best way to silence the media and keep them from rolling to the eastside to display the mayhem is for raza to act right…como gente educada!

5. Rob

   \”As far as the East Side getting a bad reputation from the wild celebrations, that’s the fault of the media. They could easily show the peaceful celebrations at any bar or restaurant on the East Side to contrast the wild behavior that took place on Whittier, but they choose not to. They just show the yuppies having a peaceful, good time in the gentrified areas of Echo Park, then show the madness at places in downtown near the arena, and the East Side, in neighborhoods where they know there are a lot of gang members who’ll use the city wide celebration as an excuse to go out and kick up dust. Just like with everything else, the media is only showing one element of society in the East Side, instead of representing the majority of the East Side, who celebrated the championship without breaking anything or intimidating anyone.\”

   The role of the media is to report the news. people behaving well is not news.

6. I understand exactly why the riots of 92 happened and to me it has nothing to do with lack of respect for one’s self or Korean-Americans, in my opinion is was owing to high unemployment, overpolicing and underpolicing and a variety of other problems that had to do with inequity. To just kind of say it was about opportunist makes me feel like I’m at a Republican convention. Weren’t those opportunist getting diapers and food? It was a much more complicated thing than just “they were ignorant over there.” I think the riots not going into East LA during 92 had alot to do with the fact that the people in the community owned the community. I don’t think that’s a little thing to gloss over I think that is a major thing. I actually think that would make an excellent paper or something.

   Of course I’m sure all of you who are making broad generalizations about South Central and the 92 riots lived there at the time and since I didn’t well I might be just talking out my ass, but I read a few accounts and talked to some people.

   And Caxcan no disrespect, but do you really think flyers can make people not riot? Because I would like to see that put in action in the upcoming months, because this city is probably going to get burn down again if people don’t get some jobs.

   I have a copy machine we better start making some positive words of wisdom for the youth…lol..

   “Yeah I know you don’t have a job and you have been gentrified out of the commerce side of your neighborhood, but here’s a flyer, stay out trouble kid or they’ll think you are from South Central.”

   And by the way crime isn’t the only reason that in the 90s there were no real grocery stores in South Central, I know it’s crazy but racism does exist, sorry.

   Browne

7. Thank you Cuca and Joel.

   Browne,

   What ever works. In the early 90’s we didn’t have twitter, facebook, etc. Flyers, word of mouth and mural/graffiti is how we got the word out.

   It was not just flyers that prevented the riots from reaching The Eastside. The entire community pitched in.

   There are somethings that are out of our control. Just be prepared. Store: atleast two weeks supply of water, food, cigaretts and tequila.

   Always trying to send positive vibes,
   Caxcan

8. Ok enough of the false hysteria about so called “eastside riots”, so a couple of knuckleheads rocked a few cars big f””ng deal.
   Bottom line, tomorrow LA will have a parade and millions of people of all races will be celebrating together our great Lakers team, world champions again! To the haters and hysterics, go out in the garden and eat worms!
   Parade starts at Staples Center and on to the historic LA Coliseum and all our great Lakers stars and the fans of the great city of LA will be partiiiing, and everone will be high five-ing and shucking and jiving.
   The great multi cultural city of the angels is on top again, every hater and nay sayer can just bite thier fingers with jealousy and envy.
   Go Lakers!

9. Cuca Racha,

   I didn’t call everyone a liar, just Caxcan. I never accused you of not living on the East Side. I just said that if you did live on the East Side, you’d be able to tell me how much business in East LA was Latino owned. You gave a smart ass answer about checking with the county registrar. I was surprised. Considering you grew up on the East Side, one would have to think that you just knew.

   So, you finally answer the question, saying that most businesses in East LA were Latino owned in ’92 (that didn’t take long, did it? Maybe you really did check in with the registrar…LOL). And, yes, that IS a big deal. Part of the reason for the riots in South Central was the relationship between the Korean business owners and the black residents. Maybe you forgot, but a young black girl was shot for stealing a candy bar. The Korean woman who shot her got a slap on the wrist. That was the first spark, right there. Was there any kind of animosity like that going on in East LA in the early ’90s? As far as I know, there wasn’t. Correct me if there was. So, it makes sense that Latinos on the East Side didn’t destroy their own community…because it actually WAS their own community. Blacks didn’t destroy their own community in South Central, because they never had one to begin with ,not since the Jazz clubs were shut down in the early ’20th century. They destroyed a Korean-American business district, and that was their very intention. You said they did it because they were opportunists. Yeh, because there was no other reason to. The relationship between blacks and the Korean business owners was just peachy, and 4 LAPD officers were not acquitted that afternoon for beating a black motorist. Those opportunists just woke up and said, “let’s riot!”, right? LOL.

10. Joel, so, again, are we talking about former gang members? Church types? Caxcan said “veteranos”, which means gang members, older gang members, high ranking, right? Either there was an order from older, active gang members to not riot, or a church group dressed like cholos was walking around handing out fliers saying, “we’re not like black people. Don’t riot!”. Which is it?

11. UnGalan, what is a Bill Cosby Democrat?

12. There are some college towns that are way more crazy than these sports riots.

    Cars get burned. People get hurt or even killed. Everything is vandalized. Everyone is running scared.

    Browne’s right about not busting things up if you feel like you have some stake in the future.

    Breaking this is inherently “fun”. The noise, the chaos. Everyone seems to like to smash bottles, hit things with a bat, or tear objects apart. Even orderly people kind of enjoy when sparks fly and smoke comes out of the machinery.

    If you feel like you own the community, or have identifiction with the machinery of society, then, you’re going to want to preserve these things.

    Those old cholos, they probably felt a deeper desire to preserve East LA in 1992 than those drunk college kids who go and riot annually in their college town, where they’re just four-year guests.

    However, I disagree about flyers being powerless. They can have an effect, by giving you ideas, even if the idea is to go to a party 🙂

    Ideas motivate people. The Bible is just a book. The Koran is just a book. Zines are just little books rich with ideas.

    During a crisis, the right ideas can move many people to work together for the common good.

    Isn’t this what this blog is about — the idea of what the Eastside is?

13. Rob, to dismiss someone’s personal experience is disrespectful especially when it seems you have no understanding of the world they live in. You’ve done that twice here now. If you read my earlier post I explained that a veterano doesn’t necessarily attribute and older active gang member. It can be just that or someone who use to be in a gang and still carries such traits such as language, dress, etc. Some veteranos are probably the local drunk who still brags about his days gang banging but his gang no longer exist. Things aren’t black and white and to assume so or go about life as if they are especially when it comes to someone else’s reality is wrong and reaps of ignorance. This is how you come across and it shows a lack of understanding for the Eastside and your insistence that it’s your way is absurd in so many ways since it someone else’s experience.

    This is a complex world and here’s a crazy idea, maybe it was both veteranos and a church group composed of former gang members, one sending an order to other gang members and the latter passing out flyers to whoever would listen. And yes maybe both messages carried racial undertones and during decade of intense fighting within prison gangs you can surely bet that those racial undertones were there. And believe it or not those racial undertones probably went further than just the gangs involved but families who lost loved ones within those prison wars.

    Here is another crazy idea. This will blow you away. Maybe just maybe things were even more complex and not everything started and ended with veteranos trying to call shots.

    1. The community felt the need to protect the community. No veretanos involved here.

    2. Gangs felt the need to protect their turf cuz how tuff would you look if your hood was looted by another gang especially one of another color.

    3. Maybe these church groups were just being opportunists and were trying to recruit new members and maybe since these people have been through so much in their lives as gang members maybe just maybe they were misguided in their ways and passed out flyers with a wrong message.

    Living in these neighborhoods in LA during the 80’s and 90’s was no joke and in no way cut and dry as you make it seem and those complexities carry on today.

    To say “Was there any kind of animosity like that going on in East LA in the early ’90s? As far as I know, there wasn’t.” is beyond ignorant. Just because you didn’t see it in the news means there wasn’t because in my lifetime I have seen many reasons for a community such as East LA to hold a great deal of animosity towards the LAPD and Sheriff’s and the system that does nothing to correct the behavior of out of control cops killing people. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Resources_Against_Street_Hoodlums

14. Joel, I never dismissed your experience. Just asked you a question. Were they active gang members handing out fliers and giving orders not to riot, or a church group? That’s all. I don’t doubt you grew up on the East Side. Not for one second, and sorry if I gave that impression. Just want some more information on these fliers and who passed them out, because I’d never heard of them until you and Caxcan brought them up. You weren’t clear as to rather they were real gang members, or church members who were former gang members. And, you still aren’t. You seem to be confused yourself as to rather or not they were active gang members. Caxcan said “veteranos” passed out fliers. Does he mean gang members? I’ve never heard of gang members making political fliers. That’s the only point I ever made.

    Why are you, Cuca, and Caxcan so paranoid that I’m accusing you guys of not being from the East Side? LOL. I’ve never done any such thing. The gang members passing out the political fliers just sounds nuts, that’s all. It’s just a hard to believe story. I’m sorry, but it is. You guys can be real East Siders and exaggerate the power of gangs in your neighborhood. So there’s no reason for me to believe that you guys aren’t really from the East Side. However, I must say, exaggerating the power of gangs is a sign of adolescence. It’s also what a lot of cops do, for obvious political reasons, and since you guys didn’t identify yourself as cops, I have no reason to believe that, either. So my guess is that you guys are either young, or, you’re adults who are just a little too intrigued by street gangs.

    As far as the animosity in East LA in the early ’90s, I was referring to business ownership. Why can’t you, Caxcan, and Cuca, you three East Siders, just answer the simple question as to how much business on the East Side was Latino owned then? In South Central, most of the business was Korean owned, and there was a great deal of hostility between the Korean business owners (not necessarily the Korean community in general, mind you, but the business owners in South Central) and the black residents of South Central. Was there similar animosity in East LA between the business ownership and the community? That’s all I want to know.

15. I’d like to point out a small, but overlooked detail in some of these arguments. Before some bad behaving Eastside Chicanos become the poster children for “Hispanics Gone Wild” when something like this happens in L.A., please consider that many of the hispanics who participated in public disturbances west of the river (1992 Rodney King riots+MacArthur Park May Day Melee+Lakers Riot this past Sunday) were in fact Central Americans who are just as capable of being knuckelheads and rabble rousers as anyone else. Neighborhoods like Pico-Union with with high Central American concentrations were central, convenient take-off points for Salvadorans, Hondurans, Guatemalans and others who also chose to misbehave. You may have seen Mexican flags in the crowd, it’s interesting to note that some central americans have no problem pretending to be Mexican. They’ll say they are from Puebla or Oaxaca or some southern region to deny their nationality, but the point is that they’re communities are a hop, skip & a jump from these last few disturbances and their participation should not be ignored. Where as East LA chicanos with bad intent have to make quite a trek across town (sometimes into other gang “jurisdictions” west of downtown where they’re reluctant to go) to participate in disturbances. There are some pretty active knuckelheads, rabble rousers, gang (MS, 18th) and opportunists in LA besides ELA and chicanos. To many people “It’s all the same thing” Mexicans or Central Americans” but many of us can tell you that it is definitely NOT the same thing. Next time you see a bunch of hispanics on the news behaving badly in LA and it’s not in the Eastside.
    keep all of this in mind.

16. Flyers can work in conjunction with other things such as ownership of a neighborhood, a feeling that people care about you, a historical connection. I think that is what made people not riot in 92 in East LA.

    The Mexican-American community in LA is one of the oldest communities in LA if not the oldest (I didn’t google that I just from my reading am pretty sure I’m close on that assumption.) And even if the cops are assholes and the press writes bs, its still a different kind of perspective, because it truly is their community, not just because they moved here, but because they were born here.

    The black community of South Central had mainly come there about 40-50 years prior and had been systematically discrimanated against from the jump; meaning people of African descent could not more around, could not get loans to open up businesses in their own neighborhoods owning to redlining and they had nothing to build upon and owing to not being able to buy in places that were going up in value. You hear plenty of people on the Eastside who have been in the Eastside for generations (and they have property which is like gold in LA) most black people who were in South Central at the time roots were firmly in the southern section of the United States and the vast majority of people’s grandparents in South Central were from the South and quite a few of people’s parents. The LAPD had a purpose to destroy the established black businesses and to routinely harass and terrorize the community.

    I can’t agree that flyers have all that much power in the light of all that. Yeah flyers and the written word can do something, but to me if you put too much value on things such as that you minimize the empowerment that the Latino community had in their own community at that time and the lack of empowerment that the African-American community had at that time. It makes it seem like with just the right words then things could have all worked out and to me words mean very little with no action or meaning behind them.

    Words can reinforce an idea you are already thinking, but it can’t turn back time and change history. Of course history books lie, but the people and their experiences and their employment rates, death rates, birth rates can’t lie, that stuff doesn’t lie.

    I could be wrong, but when I go to East LA and the Eastside most of the businesses seem to be owned by Latinos (and they have been there for ages) or at least run by them and I can’t see it being that different in 92, when you go to South Central even today you just don’t see black people owning businesses (and the ones you do see are relatively new, owned by younger people who moved in yesterday with no real connection to the neighborhood) at the same rate as you do Latinos and in general black politicians always seem more obsessed with getting big box stores in the neighborhood, I guess its for the jobs, but the jobs pay too little I think pushing for people to own their own mom and pop thing is better. Of course it’s also the whole history behind how most African-Americans got here which could impact all that, well I’m pretty sure it does.

    I think its very mythical to say it was the flyers, but that’s like people saying the reason people rioted during the Watts riots in 65 was just owing to a dj who said Burn Baby Burn.

    I don’t think people are that simple. It’s very popular to believe that people are that simple, but I think most actions are a build up of many things, some of them good and some of them bad. People are way more complicated than the typical academic thinks that they are.

    Oh and getting back to the post. I don’t know why they keep calling that Lakers thing a riot, it wasn’t a riot. Calling what happened a riot is an exaggeration.

    Browne

17. I have recollections from the disturbances of ’92 of driving around Whittier Blvd. in ELA by my parent’s house. As I drove by the big K-Mart-Target Commerce Shopping Center I saw about a half dozen army-type armored personnel carriers
    parked in front of K-Mart in the parking lot facing the sidewalk and Whittier Blvd. The guardsmen who were doing sentry duty appeared relaxed and were smiling and waving at the families walking by. It was kind of surreal, but it also gave us the feeling that all of the trouble was happening somewhere else and ELA was just hunkering down until all of it was over. The whole ELA neighborhood smelled of smoke from the fires downtown but our streets were pretty quiet. We were being told by everyone from our parents to the media to stay indoors and stay put and because there were reports that major blvds and freeways were being shut down as well as the curfews in effect, we really had no where to go even if we had wanted to go west. I was working in El Monte then and I had stopped at my parents house in ELA after work that Friday to hear the news of what was going down in the city. My mom was terrified and forbid me from leaving so I stayed at my parents place for those 3 or so days of the rioting.

18. You guys all have valid points, but Joel, Ungalan and caxcan, you guys and your name calling are currently making the eastide look like abunch of immature know it alls.

    It is wrong to call Rob such horrible streotypical things, especially when you guys chewed others out for saying much less offensive stuff that you took out of context as attacking upwardly mobile people and nonlatinos living in eastlos. Now you are attacking a person who obviously has embraced, knows a lot about and is defending our community. You guys are jumping down Rob’s throat for pretty petty reasons, and calling him some pretty low brow stuff that makes us chicanos look bad. This whole attack vibe off of you 2 commentors seems pretty consistent, maybe you guys should learn to enjoy life through living rather than attacking others. Of course, I know this last comment will bring a shit storm from both of you traviesos, but fuckit, someone has to “tell you like it is”. Isnt that what you guys supposedly do to chicano kids to keep them in line?

    Rob is accurately noting how the media makes chicanos from the eXs look bad, and that is a correct assessment. In fact, your flier analogy only proves it more, the media did not cover that at all during the 92 riots, they only showed tanks on whittier blvd and talked about when the latinos will be rioting there as well(I remember this quite well, and folks on channel 7 were acting the same way, making tons of negative untrue assumptions they dont do when it is rich white kids acting a fool). They do this all the time, tell me when ethnicity and such dirision has been mentioned when a college sports celebration becomes a riot?

    Of course personal accountability and responsibility is a big issue and something that needs to be cultivated more in our community (in terms of certain people, but not the bulk of the community who takes much more responsibility for themselves and their community thatn most of America ever will). You guys are correct to note how these fools make us chicanos and eastlos look bad (orb enver said they didnt, he noted there are also other factors involved that are pretyt significant), as well as the “hope its not a mexican” syndrome on the news we all have experienced. There is plenty internal and personal blame to go around, nobody is denying that, but recognizing the external factors does not mean that we are ignoring the internal personal responsibility issues in our barrios. Heck, the point of this website is for us to be personally responsible for covering and documenting our community, rather than allowing someone else to innaccurately do it and then bitching aboutit later.

    But in your zeal to hold our community and youngsters accountable for their behavior you cannot ignore the external motivators that play an important role as well. This issue is not black or white, and anyone who has so far claimed so (Im looking at you 2 guys who confuse recognizing external motivators as denying personal accountability, which it is not) needs to look at the issue and life a little better.

    Talk all the shit you want you guys, it seems like trying to attack others is your soup de jour. Your “shape up or ship out” mentality is true and needed in our raza/community/country, but it is only a small piece of the puzzle and cannot be viewed as some end-all be all that discredits everything else.

    And that is coming from someone who actually goes out and works with gangbangers and taggers on a weekly basis, often implementing those tough guys strategies you guys agree with to deal with dyfunctional youth, what do you 2 do besides talk shite on a website. I go out and work with these guys all the time, I came from the same background and criminal history as much fo them, and the whole asskicking thing combined with personal resilience is what got me out, which is why I apply it to others (and it works, as Im sure you guys know). I go into jails, work with guys who have shit tatted all over their faces, involve gang inthe worst areas and show them as much personal responsibility as i can in 2 hour painting sessions.

    It is not absurd to expect people to behave responsibly and dignified. It is absurd to hold our poor often uneducated traviesos to such strict standards while writing our wealthy educated media and public institutions a free pas for their contribution to the problem.

19. Art,

    Really…?

    LaEastside.com, from my understanding is a blog for people to express their own experiences living in the eastside of the river and beyond.
    For someone to mock and question my own life experience is an insult and so I choose not to address Rob’s questions.
    I have not lived my life footnoting and referencing every experience so that I can prove my self to anyone.
    Take it how you want it. It is what it is.
    If we are more curtious and know how to talk to people, we will go a long way.

    So, Art. Read again the comments that I have posted on this site. The only people I ever called names was Rob and the thugs who were destroying property Sunday night and Ms. G, not YOU or anyone else. Why are you calling me names? Please understand you are comming off as a hypocrite.
    “Horrible things,” really….LOL!! (and yes I am mocking you know.) Provacateur, Fool, Mr. Socrates, Sod, pinche culero; does not equate “Horrible things,” but I guess it is a matter of perspective and sensatibities. I have been called many things in my life and have learned to brush aside many criticisms, but do not question my honor (Rob admitted it.) Porque, after all is done and we are all dead, our honor and memory will be all that is left. I will always speak my truth-my life. Wether you like it or not, you can count on it.

    Lets have constructive conversations. Que no? And, I am a “chuppy”. Born, raised in the eastside and decided to stay.

    The Eastside will be my childs playground as well.

    Peace,
    Caxcan

20. The thing with groups like Victory Outreach back then was that you had some people within in it that truly had changed their outlook at life and were trying to live by the words of Jesus. Then you have another part of that group using religion as cover and some using it as a political platform or a way to get money from the city for gang prevention programs, so back then I can’t honestly say what these veteranos and younger cholo looking people were up too. To make a distinction it was the church groups passing out the flyers and I don’t think they had any impact since most of the community are skeptical towards groups like Victory Outreach. I am not exaggerating the power of street gangs since here I honestly can say they don’t carry much power over the community as most might think because of what the media makes things out to be but in few places these gangs do carry a lot of power over people. Again dismissing peoples experiences by saying we’re intrigued by street gangs shows a lack of understanding for growing up with street gangs around. Flyers can be a powerful tool but I highly doubt they had any impact in this case.

    Like some have mentioned before, Boyle Heights and East LA didn’t riot because of the communities investment in itself. I’m sure a large number of the businesses on the Eastside were owned or operated by people within the community and not just of Mexican descent but also Japanese and Jewish. And to say one from the Eastside did riot is wrong because people from here do go over and participate in the rioting.

    …and Art the only reason I responded so sarcastically towards Rob is that he easily dismissed the idea that a veterano active in a gang or not can take a stake in his hood and community and do something to prevent rioting.

21. What’s the over/under on “rioting/looting/civil unrest etc.” starting before the parade ever gets to the coliseum?

    Already 80K in coliseum, with thousands estimated to be on the grounds without seats or access to the actual interior.

    Mobs of people being turned away…

22. Art, thank you very much for the supportive words, and you say something that is the main point I’ve been expressing all along. What about the 99.9% of residents on the East Side who don’t do anything wrong? That just work, go home, take care of their families? Like, for starters, the authors and most of the commenters on this blog? My biggest problem with Cuca Racha’s overall sentiment is that he lumps all of the above in with the rather small percentage of East Side residents out there who kick up dust. That’s why I said he’s doing the media’s job. Why help them? LOL. And as you said, if the media showed the ugly side of LA’s wealthier areas as well, it would be another story. In fact, there’s pretty much a mini riot on the Sunset Strip every weekend…fights, bottles being thrown, streets blocked, complete disregard for police trying to get people to disperse..(where the police patiently wait for people to leave, no matter how long it takes, as opposed to going into riot mode, as they did on Whittier Sunday, and in MacAurthur Park a few years back). I’ll bet it was a zoo on the strip Sunday after the Lakers won. And, I’ve seen this with my own two eyes on the strip, several times over the course of the past decade. I went to school near Hollywood, know several people who live there, so let these guys accuse me of not knowing the culture there because I’m from Sacramento. LOL. And, although they refuse to accept the fact, I know the East Side, too. I have a couple of good friends from the East Side, and have been there several times. Do I know the East Side more than people who grew up there? Of course not. But I do feel I know it better than the media does when they make their blanketed generalizations about the East Side. So, when self proclaimed residents of the East Side give the same blanketed generalizations on the East Side that the media does, they’ll have to forgive me when I refute their claims. It’s not a matter of me barging in on territory I don’t belong in. It’s a matter of me calling bullshit when I see it.

23. Caxcan, I wish with all of your talk of peace and courtesy, you’d tone down the drama just a tad bit as well. I never “dismissed” your claims of being from the East Side. All I did was ask you a few questions about the fliers. You first said “veteranos”. I rarely hear someone use the term “veteranos” to describe anything but high ranking gangsters. If you meant church groups, like Victory Outreach, why didn’t you just say so? Why didn’t you say, “I remember Victory Outreach guys handing out fliers”?

24. UnGulan, it sounds like you want riots to happen. Is that what a “Bill Cosby Democrat” is? Someone who gives odds on the likeliness of riots? Enjoy your pudding pop, Bill Cosby Democrat, while you watch t.v. hoping for riots today.

25. 1st report of rocks and bottles thrown at officers 11:39 on
    Ch 7’s live broadcast… Congrats to whoever had 11:39 in the office pool!

26. Rob,

    You said:
    ” I never “dismissed” your claims of being from the East Side. ”

    I agree, you didn’t. Where did you get that idea?

    Lets move on.

27. I have been away, just catching up….

    Art, I know you did not include me in the list of name calling towards RobThomas, I have tried very hard not to go there with him, but the truth of the matter is he has done plenty of putting us down, the irony is that after you made that statement complimenting RobThomas he goes ahead and insults people again.

    RobThomas goes after Caxcan, by using condescending words “telling” Caxcan to tone the drama:
    Rob Thomas said: “Caxcan, I wish with all of your talk of peace and courtesy, you’d tone down the drama just a tad bit as well.”

    Rob Thomas goes after Ungalan mocking his statement of being a Bill Cosby Democrat:
    RobThomas said:”UnGulan, it sounds like you want riots to happen. Is that what a “Bill Cosby Democrat” is? Someone who gives odds on the likeliness of riots? Enjoy your pudding pop, Bill Cosby Democrat, while you watch t.v. hoping for riots today.”

    The reaction RobThomas had received, he has brought upon himself and being Chicanos, we are brought up to stand up to those who try to put us down, I don’t see how defending yourself when someone throws their accusations at you makes Chicanos look bad.

    RobThomas,

    Not being a Latino I will forgive you for some of the things you don’t know, first, Cuca is a woman’s name, I am a woman, I am not a he. Second, the term veterano in Spanish is translated to English meaning Veteran, now I do not know AlDesmadre (excuse my assumption Al) but I might call him a veterano of East LA, I love reading his post of old time East LA, but as far as I know he has never been in a gang, veterano means veteran, not only gang members are veteranos, my uncles are called veteranos, they are Vietnam War veteranos and have never been in a gang, my point is that the term veterano can be added to almost anybody who is a veteran of something, not just veteran gang members. As Joel stated, someone may have left a gang but may still have some traces of their pass gang life, tattoos, style of dress and people may call him a veterano, even if he no longer participates in gang activities, I think people have repeatedly explained this to you but you have refused to look beyond the point that non gang members might be called veteranos.

    Rob, if you want to talk about a new thread regarding “Lakers Fans In Eastside Riot!” the topic of this segment, I welcome it, but I personally am done going back and forth with you, regarding the Latasha Harlins incident, which was NOT the reason the Rodney King riots started in South Central LA, it was because the policemen who did these terrible things to Rodney King got a slap in the hand and the community was just fed up with the injustice they had to live and endure for so long. I am done.

    If there was a flyer or not, quit harping on that, two people who lived in East LA at the time remember seeing them, you weren’t there to say it didn’t happen. I am done.

    On how many businesses in East LA are Latino owned, the truth is, who knows, just because you walk into a place and the people who work there are Latinos doesn’t mean Latinos own it, otherwise we would own the Target, the K-mart, the Payless and the larger businesses in the community. I DO live on the Eastside and don’t know the exact percentage of Latino owned businesses, I go back to my original answer, go to the LA County Registrar Recorders office for true numbers. I am done.

    I am trying to be as Chicanically correct (my take of politically correct) as possible for Art’s sake and because I was brought up con buenos modales. This segment got a lot of comments and thats what this website is all about.

    Peace out! Viva los Lakers!

28. Few things…

    Mob mentality and unruly behavior surrounding sporting events obviously isn’t limited to East LA/Latinos. Does anyone remember Detroit burning back in ’89 when the Pistons won the Championship? Chicago had ’em too when the Bulls did it the early 90s. Back in London where my wife is from – having riot police in the stadiums ready to roll is standard procedure. It’s not just an LA thing at all.

    I recalled my LA Riot memories over on a post in April here on LA Eastside. One thing I do remember about that era was that people did pass out and post a LOT of homemade flyers when noteable things happened. I was home on leave from the Marines in ’86, standing outside of a Westwood movie theater passing out flyers explaining why the move “Soul Man” was racist garbage. Rob Thomas referred to a young Black girl killed by a Korean shopkeeper (the item in question was orange juice, not a candy bar). South LA was covered with simple flyers posted everywhere saying “Remember Latasha” – referring to the death of Latasha Harlins. I do remember flyers from that time too trying to get Black people to boycott Asian owned businesses… Another instance I remember vividly was after the OJ Simpson verdict came down – you could drive all over West LA and see homemade signs that said “Guilty” posted on telephone and light poles. So the idea of OGs out on the street passing out flyers doesn’t seem too far fetched to me. Victory Outreach guys are forever handing out flyers about gatherings, car washes, prayer meetings, etc.

    Finally, LA’s Fox affliate (and the LA Weekly too) have been known to ramp up the out of control “Cholo” vibe to get ratings and get people to pick up that free weekly. I’d take that with a grain of salt when checking out their coverage of Latinos in LA.

29. i just dont like seeing someone who is a positive contributor to this site be attacked like rob has, i think we all actually think along the same page and are getting caught up in semantics and uneccessary drama. most of us are eastsiders, so we all know drama rarely leads to any good, so enough of it. Everyone had valid points, aside from the name calling.

    The parade was peaceful, that one report was it and it was minor. Otherwise several hundred thousand laker fans and chicanos celebrated with class and dignity. The newscasters were even talking about how little trash was left behind.

    BTW Cuca, props for the term “chicanically correct”! And to those others who actually werent calling names my apologies, I read all the desmadre quickly and lumped everone together. my point is we all are on the same page, considering the history of our community derision to fullfill personal issues is unecessary and detrimental to what we are concerned about, whether we be 3rd gener eastlos natives (like myself) or someone who appreciates and embraces the community. I noted before that i dont connote chupp or gentrification in the negative sense off the bat and I mean it, we need all the help we can get to improve our community.

    And to the smarmy chuppie who doesnt know when to curb their hubris: it doesnt matter if you live in eastlos if you do nothing to help your community/raza other than bitching on a website. My organization has been mitigating blight and working with gangsters/dysfunctional youth for almost a decade and we have gotten almost ALL of our donations from wealthy jews, asians and chicanos who dont live in the eastlos area. We havent gotten shite from any chuppie, in fact no organization that does not do a coolness dog and pony show to coddle hip people has, ask Homeboy Ind. or VELA or mictlan murals or the cincinatti and es boys and girls clubs. So put your money where your mouth is: http://www.elacamp.org

    I got your passive aggressive comment about having your kids play in the eastside, but guess what, you have no kids! You also act as if moving back to ela somehow gives you merit enough to try and attack someone who has dedicated almost a decade of their life to improving the community you are from, good job! the last park my kids went to was belvedere, and before that hollenbeck, and before that granda which is a park in alhambra I used to go to when I lived in aliso village.

    I shouldnt devote any more negative energy to this, but I couldnt help it.

30. Art,

    I salute you for helping the Eastside community. But, I might remind you, you don’t know me. You have no idea what I have done for my community. I am not going to name drop and put many of the things on my resume because the things I did, were for selfgratification and I do not need a pat in the back,

    Hubris? I am not the one name dropping.

    I never left the barrio, and to assume I did, well…that is your problem.

    Here is some of my background:
    Malabar Elementary-
    First St Elementary-
    Hollenbeck Jr. High-
    Francisco Bravo High-
    ELACC-
    Cal State L.A.-

    And I currently work in Boyle Heights

    So please Art, stop attacking and if you can’t, “help it,” May I suggest breathing exercises.

    The difference between me and you is that I probably have self control. (I am not assuming I am guessing.) But a fact is that I read all the comments in their entirly and do not lump people together.

    I love my barrio/colonia just as much as you do. Do me and everyone a favor, read all comments in their entirty, if you assume you are making an ass out yourself because I sure as hell will not let you make an ass out of me.

    One last thing:

    So, EASTSIDERS, I am new to your site. You all got to know a little about me, and I got to know a little about some of you. Hopefully we can use our energies in the future in a collective way to better our communities.

    Mexica Tiahui,
    Caxcan

31. Well it looks like the naysayers and hysterics, no matter what the race, ethnicity, or agenda, are eating a large slice of humble pie and burrito de “foot in mouth”.
    Today everyone in LA had a ball celebrating the great victory by the Lakers and their fans.
    A million or so people got together, people of all racial and ethnic backgrounds and forgot about the sniping and racism that the comes from the twisted minds of race baiters and provocateurs, who would love to see a riot or some sort of conflagration so they can point the ugly bony finger of ethnocentrism and racism at a certain group of people.
    So it gives me great satisfaction to point out, despite the disappointment in some circles, that the Laker parade and party at the historic Coliseum was a great success for the entire city and it’s multi-ethnic people.

    Riot? We don’t need to show you no damn riot!

32. Guess the Bill Cosby Democrat lost his paycheck. He laid it all on riots happening.

    Cuca, you’ve just cranked the drama meter so far beyond 10 that you’ve broke the dial. I didn’t “go after” either you or Caxcan. The two of you came in here and went after two different groups; East Side Chicanos and South Central blacks. And I don’t care what ethnicity either of you are. (or gender, while we’re at it). Both of you were wrong, and I wasn’t afraid to say it. You can coil up into your “I’m Chicano and you’re not, so I’m right” blanket all you want to, but the truth is other Chicanos, from the East Side, have come onto this thread and debunked your guys’ crap, too. It’s obvious that being Chicano in and of itself does not give you leverage in an intellectual discussion on this blog. And if it did, no big. I’ll just post under a different screen name and claim to be a Chicano, too. If that doesn’t help, I’ll add another wrinkle and claim to be a female Chicano. As it stands, however, it’s obvious that this blog is too smart for that. It’s just taking you a while to realize it.

33. Hey Caxcan, your last paragraph in your recent comment is nice. Why didn’t you start off with that? Why did you instead start with this:

    “Cuca, I’m with you on the “Rodney King” point.”

    You started off signing on to Cuca Racha’s theory that Chicanos are supposed to be better than blacks, now you’re all about peace and communication. Hey, it’s progress. Congratulations.

34. Rob…. Time to get yourself another meter.

    Rob, I am thinking you just might be the wolf dressed as a chicken in the chicken coup. You try to come in here and “identify” with us by enraging us on how we are abused by the media and the police. We all have seen and lived how unfair the media and the police are with us and it is a soft spot that easily can get us going, I think you know that.

    You also just tried to be like the media and try stirring up a little Latino vs. Blacks thing here, not going for it. I have not said anything on this thread on how Chicanos are supposed to be better than blacks, let me quote you because you tend to forget.

    RobThomas said: You started off signing on to Cuca Racha’s theory that Chicanos are supposed to be better than blacks.

    Show me where I said that please.

    You also need to be enlighten a bit, when I refer to the South Central LA community, I as a person who lives in Los Angeles am greatly aware that the South Central LA community has a very large Latino population, so if on my thread I have ever referred to the South Central LA community I am aware that it also includes MANY Latinos.

    Now let me address a little further on how you tried to insight anger between the two races:
    RobThomas said: The two of you came in here and went after two different groups; East Side Chicanos and South Central blacks.

    Rob, stop your madness, I am seeing right through you. Once again, show me where I came in here and went after East Side Chicanos and South Central Blacks. I came in here angry that we (Latinos) gave the biased media something to talk about, plain and simple.

    You show me where I said “I’m Chicano and you’re not, so I’m right” and where I have been “debunked”.
    RobThomas said: You can coil up into your “I’m Chicano and you’re not, so I’m right” blanket all you want to, but the truth is other Chicanos, from the East Side, have come onto this thread and debunked your guys’ crap, too.

    The truth of the matter is you were schooled and you got angry, its OK, we all get schooled once in a while.

    You said you might come back with a new screen name, you didn’t do that already and call yourself Art and give yourself props??? Naw, Art made some sense couldnt have been you.

    To end my thoughts, I will quote you: “Tone down the drama”

    Peace out.

35. Cuca Racha, identify with you?!?!? I have no such desire! As far as identifying with the authors and most of the commenters here, I already do. I don’t try to. The reason I like this blog is because I agree with so much of what they say. In fact, I make more effort to NOT be like you. I try not to blame all people of a race for the behavior of a few. In fact, I outright do not do it. I’m nothing like you, and don’t want to be like you. So get that through your head right now. And since you’re accusing people who comment here of “trying to identify”, are you revealing by contrast that you’re here to “not identify”, in other words, start shit? In other words, a troll? I think so.

    And remember, I am not the only person who disagrees with your narrow minded, bullshit views on the East Side. Chicanos from the East Side have jumped in the discussion, including a famous columnist, for crying out loud, and have debunked your crap generalizations, too. The only comeback you’ve been able to muster since is, “Well, I’m Chicano, and you’re white, so I win”. No, you don’t. I’m Chicano too. From the East Side. Born and raised. Want me to prove it? I’ll prove it when you prove you’re Chicano and from the East Side. There. How easy was that?

36. Rob, I am not trying to accuse people, there you go again, not listening and changing things around, I am saying that YOU, not people who comment here, but YOU are trying to identify with us, which is cool, I have no problem with that, but dont start things. Below you once again tried to make others angry.

    RobThomas said: And since you’re accusing people who comment here of “trying to identify”, are you revealing by contrast that you’re here to “not identify”, in other words, start shit? In other words, a troll? I think so.

    Rob, I have not blamed people of a race for the behavior of a few. Be specific when you talk because you made a general statement that I blame all people of a race, no, I was upset at the people of MY race who went too far in their celebration. When you are part of a community that is constantly seen with a bad light, on the news, on TV, in the movies, etc., you get tired of it and get upset when we act like they want us to act. When we are portrayed unfairly people lump us all together. When I can sit in UCLA, in a classroom and be asked by a classmate “Where in Mexico is El Salvador?” you realize how people lump us all together and go by what they see on TV. So when I get upset at other Latinos who caused mayhem and lump them with myself, it is because I know that it is how many people see us, it could have been only 2 idiots out there and they would have said East LA was out of control, when you live your whole life experiencing this, you say to yourself, not again!

    RobThomas said: I try not to blame all people of a race for the behavior of a few.

    If you want to go over some of the things where I have been “debunked” I welcome it, but just show me my exact quotes.

    Rob, I don’t have a problem with you, but I will call you out when you are trying to start something.

    Peace out!

37. Que chingasos – jejejejejeje

38. Hey People,
    This post currently has 87 responses. If we get to 100 responses, it’s FREE TACOS FOR EVERYONE!!! WOOOHOOO!!!

39. AlDesmadre,

    See what you started! j/k

    Great topic and reporting. All you need is a spark.

    Keep up the great work.

    Thank you,
    Caxcan

40. Cuca Rucha, I have never tried to identify with YOU, or anyone like YOU, in my life. You came onto this blog and first insinuated that Chicanos shouldn’t riot because rioting is for blacks. What else could you have meant when you said that the East Side was “proud” to not have participated in the Rodney King riots? Then you went on to do the media’s bidding and paint the entire East Side with a brush, saying that the revelers on Sunday made the entire East Side look bad (only to outsiders who don’t know the real East Side, and you, of course). Now, for the second time, you’ve accused me of trying to identify with you? Name one thing about yourself that I’ve ever tried to identify with. I don’t want to be anything like you. I know people like you. We all have a Republican, or, excuse me, “Bill Cosby Democrat” (LOL) in the family. I’ve heard all your bullshit before. It’s nothing new. It’s that big, wide brush. You approach every single social ill with it. There’s no nuance. There’s no story. There’s no humility. There’s just God and the devil, patriots and traitors, black and white. Nothing else. A few East Siders shake an MTA bus? The East Side looks bad. They’re acting just like South Central residents (only a small percentage of South Central residents participated in the riots as well, btw). Generalization after generalization. Cuca, I spend my entire life trying to NOT be like you. Whenever I’m angry about anything, I try to think the situation through so I don’t fall into your myopic, simple minded, and hateful way of thinking.

    BTW, if you’re going to say that I try to identify with you because you’re Chicano? Don’t forget, I’m Chicano too. And I’m from the East Side. Heck, you know what? I’m a female, too. There. Now we’re even. So, you can no longer rest on that crutch.

    You came in here, bashed South Central, bashed the East Side, then went right to ad hominem attacks on me simply because of my background and ethnicity, insisting that I can’t know what the East Side is like because I’m from Sacramento. Never mind that Sacramento is only a half day’s drive from LA, and that I actually lived in LA for two brief periods of time while attending school. You make it sound like Sacramento is in fucking Canada. About a third of the Sacramento area’s residents anymore are LA transplants. Oh, and guess the ethnicity of most of them? Shit, Sacramento is slowly becoming the East Side! So come off of it, or find a new debate tactic. Because your whole “I’m Chicano, you’re white” strategy failed at about the time the 3rd or 4th East Side Chicano jumped into the discussion to debunk your bullshit.

41. Cuca hands RobThomas a taco and a cerveza, we earned it.

    =) YUM!

42. Rob,

    I will let you keep the taco I just gave you, but I need to show you where you are mistaken again. Please quote me if you are going to say I said something.

    OK, OK you are not like me, I will call you Robin since now you are a female.
    RobThomas said: .Heck, you know what? I’m a female, too.

    Rob do you have a hard time comprehending things or do you just read what you want to read??? You said the following.

    RobThomas said: You came onto this blog and first insinuated that Chicanos shouldn’t riot because rioting is for blacks.

    Could you please once again tell me where I said this????? Quotes please! Going for the Latino vs. Blacks again, stop it already its old and not working.

    Do you actually read my responses??
    RobThomas said: What else could you have meant when you said that the East Side was “proud” to not have participated in the Rodney King riots?

    I meant the Eastside community, people who live in East LA, was proud that they did not participate in rioting going on like in South Central LA. Once again, pay attention, Latinos live in South Central LA and they were right there looting and causing disturbance like everyone else. Your close mindedness is showing, I explained to you that South Central LA has MANY Latinos, and some participated in this melee, BUT East LA, DID NOT do this to their community. It is not a race thing, it is a community thing. Comprende???

    You then didn’t once again understand the point of view of many Latinos, we hate seeing other Latinos doing things that the media can come down on us about, I am sorry you do not understand this but its probably because you haven’t experienced it.

    RobThomas said: Then you went on to do the media’s bidding and paint the entire East Side with a brush, saying that the revelers on Sunday made the entire East Side look bad

    I can proudly say I have always been a proud Democrat, worked on the Obama election and am proud to have a Democrat in office again. I can proudly say that my family and friends are all Democrats, amongst my friends and relatives, we don’t have a Republican amongst us, but you can be my first Republican friend!

    RobThomas said: . We all have a Republican

    Rob, I thought I showed humility offering you a taco and a beer?

    RobThomas said: There’s no humility.

    Hmmmm when did I attack your ethnicity? I forgave you for not knowing Cuca was a woman’s name, I don’t remember attacking you. I don’t even think in my whole thread I said the city of Sacramento??? You really have a complex and read things that are not there. In psychology they call that selective memory.

    RobThomas said: went right to ad hominem attacks on me simply because of my background and ethnicity, insisting that I can’t know what the East Side is like because I’m from Sacramento.

    If I never mentioned the city of Sacramento how can I make it sound like its in Canada???? Are you sure you are having this conversation with me??? Please find the quote where I said this, you have not showed me a quote yet. I can’t come off of it if I never got on it??? Quote please.

    RobThomas said: You make it sound like Sacramento is in fucking Canada. So come off of it, or find a new debate tactic.

    I keep asking you to show me where people “debunked” me, quotes please! When did I even acknowledge you were White, that’s not an issue for me.

    RobThomas said: Because your whole “I’m Chicano, you’re white” strategy failed at about the time the 3rd or 4th East Side Chicano jumped into the discussion to debunk your bullshit.

    Robin, take your taco and be quiet, we really don’t have to get to 100 responses to get free tacos! I was offering a Mexican peace offering, but you only read what you want to read, pobresita.

43. Anyone notice how much more tolerant and open minded Cuca and Caxcan are, now? They both came on here insisting that Chicanos on the East Side shouldn’t riot because it equates them to blacks in South Central, now they’re all about peace, love, communication and sharing tacos! Hey, mission accomplished. While you’re on a crusade to win this argument, Cuca Racha, you’ve become a more open minded person in the process. Congratulations.

44. Robin, quotes please! Quit talking your madness without backing it up!

    Quit trying to insite people again. Can’t you go one on one with me??? Trying to see who will come and defend you???

45. Out of respect for the blog, I’m deleting what I originally said in this comment. I don’t like seeing my name as one of two continual names in the recent comments section. It looks like a flame war that I’m involved in. So, I’m ending it here and now. Cuca, all the best.

46. It looks like LA Eastside blog is getting a taste of the true RobThomas. Enjoy. Props to Cuca Racha for the Robin label. She earned it.

47. I haven’t seen a lot of Cuca or Caxcan before this thread, and I’ve certainly never seen any comments by you (under the name, “don’t matter”). Art and Browne, who contribute to this blog regularly, seemed to agree with most of what I said, and their opinion means a lot more to me than anonymous commenters whose arguments seem to hinge on personal insults. One thing I can say about this thread, notice how much more positive Cuca and Caxcan are now! They both came on here blaming the revelers Sunday night for a media that has always unfairly focused on negative behavior in poorer neighborhoods, and saying that East Side residents are better than South Central residents (scroll up to the second comment by Cuca Racha, and the first comment by Caxcan), and now they’re talking about opening up courteous lines of communication, supporting Obama…LOL. What a difference a thread makes. As I said before, mission accomplished. What more can you ask out of a blog?

    How close are we to 100? I’m hungry and those tacos sound good, AlDesmadre.

    The True RobThomas

48. damn! this …ish got crazy!

49. Rob,

    You are delusional.

    Seek some help.

50. I can almost taste those tacos…………..